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Monday, 10 October 2005


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Somedays I try to ponder the meaning of all this - why am I on this IF journey? What self-discovery will result? Did I get stuck with IF because I am strong enough to bear this burden, as hard as it might be? And other days, I think this is just a random crappy luck of the draw.
I know I'm not doing justice to the eloquence of your post but these are just my rough thoughts. But I don't buy the paternalistic "it's all in Gd's hands" theory either.


Boethius....Ord, there's a name I haven't heard since my freshman year at university. A timely refresher course. Thank you.

Must be something in the water. I just posted (though not nearly so eloquently) on a similar theme.


Yes...that should have said LORD, not Ord. Damn my stiff fingers!

kate #2

Beautiful post. With my sneak peak at happiness, I also couldn't stop thinking about how Ovagirl was feeling. I almost didn't post my entry yesterday for her sake. But, I know that in the end...we all are just praying to see the ellusive double line. Sometimes, we need to see that IF treatments sometimes do work. I was really doubting it myself.

Thalia, I don't know where you live. But, as an American I feel we are born with the "American Dream" philosophy that if you work hard enough, you will get what you want. Hard knock lessons show us this isn't true...especially with IF.

In my positive days over this journey, I too tried to believe that everything happened for a reason. But, how could we keep trying if we didn't truly believe our actions could help alter the end result? Doesn't that remove the God factor?

Oh, the beauty of philosophy -- there is no definite answer is there? Great post.


I was just doing some musings of my own on the whole "fate" thing. It is weird to know that your worst day is somebody else's best. Maybe it is a biorythm thing? There are many moments in my life that sucked but I can look back & say, "aha! I learned ____ from that moment." I know if & when I ever do get pg I will have an appreciation that is profound. But all the attempts, all the waiting, all the false hope...at the moment it blows chunks! Looking forward to looking back on this.


Wow, Thalia, that was an incredible post. It's mid-afternoon and you shouldn't make me think so hard before I've had my cookies and juice! I'm going to have to come back and re-read that poem. Amazing.

I do not know what I think about G-d anymore. As someone who has had 7 miscarriages, I don't buy into the "it's all for the good" or "there's a reason" thing either. I'm tired of trying to pull one over on myself, and that is what those sorts of comments feel like to me. If there is a G-d, then I believe that for whatever reason, He is not involved in the physical world at all. It was set into motion, and that is that, and as you said, some people are shit out of luck.

Thanks again for a beautiful post.


I agree that it's very difficult to believe in God when there is so much suffering in the world... so much suffering that can never be balanced with enough joy. (There ain't enough yin for that much yang, ya dig?) No matter how many good things happen to earthquake survivors in Pakistan, they'll never be same after what's happened to them. The idea that God has no control over earthly happenings... he's just a way to help us cope with whatever happens, is slightly more appealing to me but still problematic. Great post, btw. Thank you so much for thinking of moi, too!


The fact that so many of us are posting to our own blogs similar versions of you have so eloquently wrote is proof that we each have our own cycle, our own ups and downs and occassionaly, these seem to overlap.

I honestly believe that for everyone seeking what may seem so elusive right now, fortune's wheel will smile. We control how (or if) we respond when it comes rolling down the street.

fisher queen

Oh Thalia how great. You quoted TS Eliot! I want to come sit next to you and put my head on your shoulder.

It's an interesting question. I do believe in God, but think that the idea of "a plan" sounds pretty human.

And a thought: Eliot writes that the condition of complete simplicity is always here. Does that mean we can we find it even during our awful searches, and not just at their conclusion? Maybe hints of it. He is talking about a process, isn't he? All that about the waves, and everything. Can we take an English class together?

Thanks for such a good post.


But what about the people whose luck never does turn good, who never do make it to the other side and the land of milk and honey? The world is teeming with them?

I do believe in god but I have turned it around every which way and I find it impossible to believe in a god who is both all-powerful and good. There cannot be (a) a god who is all-powerful and (b) good and (c) permits the unbearable, unredeemed suffering of innocent people in this world. I figure you have to pick between all-powerful and good. So I pick good. I think god is the name we give to everything that is good. But good is not all-powerful. Not powerless, but not all-powerful. We are surrounded by evidence of that.

Amazing post - very thought-provoking.


Excellent post. Very cerebral. Very touching.


Thalia...a beautiful and thought provoking post. All I know is, in the midst of great pain there is still potential for hope, for happiness, for beauty. In my darkest moments, there is inevitably something surprising - a phone call, a stupidly beautiful flower, a kiss, or a divinely written and thought out post that pulls me back from the darkness. And it could be just a few seconds of reprieve, but those moments exist.


That was utterly beautiful. Thank you for such a pensive post.


I love your blog...

What a gorgeous post. You so often say what I'm thinking, only so much better.


I've spent a lot of the last two years musing on fate, luck, and God. Like Reprogirl, I've faced the fact that God is either not all powerful or not all good. The latter is even harder to accept that the first, but the first goes against so much I learned growing up. I think it's hard to accept that this pain and suffering isn't part of a plan.


This, too, was wonderful.

I don't believe in a plan, universal or divine. But what never ceases to amaze and delight me - a keep me moving forward when it is really hard - is seeing how strong & wonderful & compassionate people can be. When things are as bad as they can be you can always find people who've survived & picked themselves up and carried on; there is tremendous hope in that.

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